From - Wed Jan 14 17:26:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: from relay1.UU.NET by mrco.carleton.ca (4.1/SMI-4.0) id AA08596; Sun, 28 Feb 93 01:30:55 EST Received: from nyx.cs.du.edu by relay1.UU.NET with SMTP (5.61/UUNET-internet-primary) id AA18158; Sun, 28 Feb 93 01:29:25 -0500 Received: by nyx.cs.du.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA16185; Sat, 27 Feb 93 23:30:11 MST From: ahawks@nyx.cs.du.edu (andy) Message-Id: <9302280630.AA16185@nyx.cs.du.edu> X-Disclaimer: Nyx is a public access Unix system run by the University of Denver. The University has neither control over nor responsibility for the opinions or correct identity of users. Subject: FutureCulture Digest #264 To: future-digest@nyx.cs.du.edu Date: Sat, 27 Feb 93 23:30:11 MST X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.3 PL11] Content-Length: 11553 X-Lines: 314 X-Mozilla-Status: 8001 ______________________________________________________________________ |______________ / | | / | | u t u r e <___________ u l t u r e | _______________________________________________________________________| Issue #264 Saturday, February 27th 1993 Today's Topics: --------------- any questions? Got an idea for a movie NEWS: NewsClip, my report oops Re: conspiracies to the vector the spoils USENET resource... __________________________________________________________________________ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1993 18:52:09 -0800 (PST) From: John Frost Subject: USENET resource... Andy... Regarding the rebuilding of the net to what I interpret as a more integrated approach. (Okay... it's a lot more then that... summing it up in three words or less is an injustice. ) You might want to post your proposal to the newsgroup news.future. I read it occaisionally and have found that many of the movers and shakers of USENET are to be found there. if you don't get that newsgroup at nyx I'll post it there and try to relay any comments back to ya. frost@netcom.com ______________________________ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1993 20:35:21 +0600 (CST) From: Liang Jie Subject: Re: conspiracies On Sat, 27 Feb 1993, scooby dooby doo drooled, slavered and slung: > yeah, if conspiracy exists between a group of people, then it at one > time had residancy on an individual, ie, a conspiracy of 1.....in your > [sub|pre]conscious mind.. > > your pre-conscious mind is a conspiracy, because it is a door where > empty space might be....it is the unknown depths of consciousness that > gives rise to conspiracy theories and truths..... > > you are potentially part of the conspiracy against yourself... hmmmm......words are powerful buggers aren't they? you can meme yourself into a real festival of chaos with a statement like that. i mean this statement implies that everything is a conspiracy, right? i mean if all thoughts, which originate from the pre-conscious mind, are conspiratorial, then all which is....is conspiracy. anybody got a dictionary? conspiracy is a political metaphor. not all thoughts are political in nature. "green grass in sunshine" is not a conspiracy, merely a thought. but then again, maybe i am conspiring to convince others of this view, so therefore this is a conspiracy............ ;) > -- > > andy > cybyr .happy-sig :):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):):) people fly in icey flows of data streams and signal strength may vary but data's never tarry travel time is fine if mary is contrary but data flounder in the sea of storage please sir can i have another cup of poor-edge cybyr (i know i am not nearly the poet as others, but it just happened) ______________________________ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1993 21:14:28 +0600 (CST) From: Cybyr Subject: oops My girlfriend was using my account to send some mail...... cybyr ______________________________ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 93 14:24:51 +1100 From: Kenneth McKenzie Wark Subject: to the vector the spoils Sameer was right on the money when he said that information is a vector that can't be controlled. Shit. This person is in high school and has such a fantastic intuitive grasp of netcomm! You'll make a helluva research student if you want to go on to uni, etc. He (i'm assuming Sameer is a he name, correct me if i'm wrong) is also on the right track in greping the net on the one hand and putting it out in a zine in his own flavour on the other. I think its a very important inf-survival strategy, both for individuals and for us to create new forms of info-collectivity. We have to experiment with ways of seducing and being seduced by information. The idea of controlling it is now completely meaningless. WE are seduced by info but we can also seduce it. By seduction i mean the game of dissimulation and fascination Baudrillard talks about in Seduction, and also Kierkergaard's Diary of a Seducer in Either/Or vol.1. Seduction has nothing to do with desire, which presumes an underlying drive. Seduction is all surfaces, all artifice, ultimately all arbitary. This is the frightening thing, and ultimately the reason why there is no going back to the village. Information has been so thoroughly uprooted from the earth that it no longer automatically connects us to each other, to the future, to the dead, to the earth. We no longer have roots, we have aerials We no longer have origins, we have terminals... Or as Burroughs said, in the interzone, 'nothing is true, everything is permitted.' In this terrifying situation there are only too choices: retreat into the false promises of salvation or plunging headlong into the arbitrary world of contextless information.... and hoping there's light somewhere at the other end of this black hole. In short, i agree with Spivak: McLuhan's global village was a stupid dream, a demented catholic vision. The future will be far more terrifying meaningless and interesting than that. ************************ Andy want to know where the fc list is going: i cut'n'mix bits of it and post it onto pegasus (oz version of econet), on to System X (local arthacker bbs) and email the odd bit to the !mindgun folks to stay on the sub list (well, they're friends of mine 8-| Andy, if you want me to NOT pass on stuff i will stop. My position is i assume everything is shareright unless peple *explicitly* ask not to be re-posted. Willard the evil bastard (and yes, i have made some pretty extreme sacrifices to *become* Willard - the shape-shift alone takes enormous effort. (They don't call me Slim for nothin'!) ______________________________ Subject: Got an idea for a movie From: bwp@mindvox.phantom.com (Jane Doe) Date: Sat, 27 Feb 93 22:50:21 EST Remake Othello. Arnold Schwarzenegger as O., Whitney Houston as Desde. -3j ______________________________ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 93 15:01:44 +1100 From: Kenneth McKenzie Wark Subject: any questions? ghoast relates a quite common tale about getting information out of the nets. Frankly, if i'd been on and you asked about William Gibson i would probably have ignored it or directed you to faqs. Its not that i'm elitist, its just that it takes up all my time answering *interesting* questions. The faul lies, in the first place, with your friend's teacher setting what sounds like a pretty dull assignment. In the second place, it's soemtthing you could research much more easily in a library. There must be at least a dozen interviews with gibson that would show up in indexes. I'll bet there's at least 3 or 4 ref. works on, say US authors, Who's Who of sf, that kind of thing... To some extent the ethics of the nets is contractual. If you appear willing to add your infohack skills to the pot then you can draw on those of others. I think in principle *everybody* has something to teach, to amuse, to amaze, to enlighten others. I think that asking *interesting* questions is a contribution too. But routine requests for easily available info is what faqs were created for. If there isn't a gibson-faq then write one. Willard the evil bastard (in an evil mood) Now here's what's happeing in your world (even as we speak). ______________________________ From: zane@ddsw1.mcs.com (Sameer Parekh) Subject: NEWS: NewsClip, my report Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1993 23:14:20 -0600 (CST) Having read about NewsClip on both Extropians and FutureCulture, I decided to check it it. I ftp'ed it, and compiled it. It wasn't very difficult to install. (I had a few problems, but I fixed them easily.) It looks promising. I haven't read the manual yet-- I'll do that off-line sometime soon. -- Sameer_Parekh zane@ddsw1.MCS.COM zane@infopls.chi.il.us PFA related mail to pfa@ddsw1.MCS.COM | Specialization is for insects Anonymous mail to ap.2363@cupid.sai.com | - Robert A. Heinlein Sat Feb 27 21:01:44 1993 US Debt: $4,261,742,130,285 Per capita: $16,621 ______________________________ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1993 22:02:17 -0800 (PST) From: Liquid Dog Subject: Re: conspiracies On Sat, 27 Feb 1993, Liang Jie wrote: > > On Sat, 27 Feb 1993, scooby dooby doo drooled, slavered and slung: > > > yeah, if conspiracy exists between a group of people, then it at one > > time had residancy on an individual, ie, a conspiracy of 1.....in your > > [sub|pre]conscious mind.. > > > > your pre-conscious mind is a conspiracy, because it is a door where > > empty space might be....it is the unknown depths of consciousness that > > gives rise to conspiracy theories and truths..... > > > > you are potentially part of the conspiracy against yourself... > > hmmmm......words are powerful buggers aren't they? you can meme yourself > into a real festival of chaos with a statement like that. i mean this > statement implies that everything is a conspiracy, right? i mean if all > thoughts, which originate from the pre-conscious mind, are conspiratorial, > then all which is....is conspiracy. anybody got a dictionary? conspiracy > is a political metaphor. not all thoughts are political in nature. "green > grass in sunshine" is not a conspiracy, merely a thought. but then again, > maybe i am conspiring to convince others of this view, so therefore this is > a conspiracy............ ;) yup, I think i'd have to agree with cybyr. In staying true to the anti-meme--entropicism movement ;) to say that every thought is a conspiracy is like claiming every word to be a book in it's fetal stage. Even conspiratal thoughts cannot yet be considered a conspiracy. *kneels in the confession booth* as a little kid, I conspired to make my sister go insane, so we wouldn't have to share bedrooms anymore....but the worse thing i ever did was make her believe E.T. lived in the bumps in the ceiling and put toothpaste in her nose as she slept. ...wouldn't call that a conspiracy.. maybe a poser conspiracy. to get technical, and sound anal, i dont think something is a conspiracy, until it is put into action, because it can only be judged by it's result. If you try to gleam the point of the above brain-fart, you will die in futility...ther is none....i just had to put in my $.03 (inflation) Type At You Later liQuId the molten wien'r dog from the beverly hillbillies > > -- > > > > andy > > > > cybyr > liq _________________________________________________________________________ | | | That's all for today! | | To send a message to the list: future@nyx.cs.du.edu | | To subscribe/unsubscribe/change format: future-request@nyx.cs.du.edu | | All other requests: future-request@nyx.cs.du.edu | | List Maintainer is: (andy [aka hawkeye]) ahawks@nyx.cs.du.edu | |_________________________________________________________________________| | | | The opinions expressed in FutureCulture are those of the individual | | author only. | |_________________________________________________________________________|